Another item of interest about the DNC - From the Navy Times - “On the last night of the Democratic National Convention, a retired Navy four-star took the stage to pay tribute to veterans. Behind him, on a giant screen, the image of four hulking warships reinforced his patriotic message. But there was a big mistake in the stirring backdrop: those are Russian warships.”

LiedToAgainAndAgain,

Dude.....You need to enhance your calm.........

I know it's hard to cope when confronted with reality and the words of our constitution...

You rail against Sinclair Lewis and Atheists and accuse anyone who disagrees with your fantasy as card carrying members of the....He man America hating club.

You do realize that's the same drivel that Sarah Palin and those mouth breathing wackaloon Tea Party morons spew?

It's nonsense.

Why would you accuse those who disagree with you as haters and Liars?

Who made you the keeper of all that is right and good?

Wait....I bet it came with the secret decoder ring in your Captain Crunch as a boy...

Separation of Church and State is the law of the land in America and we are better for it.....

My feeling of sheer happiness listening to Christians proclaim their willingness to vote for the Mormon with the magic under wear grows daily...

The Mormon who has Vouchercare pathological liar dude as his running mate.

Yeah baby that’s the dream ticket…..

The very notion that middle class citizens will vote for those who intend to take their Medicare and Medicaid is a Greek tragedy....Truly...

Just goes to show how the gullible can be controlled if you say GOD is on your side.

But not to worry...us atheists and liberals and Latinos and African Americans and all the other citizens who are not you will make sure the Mormon and Liar loses.

That way you can keep your benefits and still spew hatred...

So your welcome for the freedom to be ignorant....We the adults and take care of it for you.

BTW I am STILL in Iraq protecting that freedom...What have YOU done for your country today?

Rhuidean

Looks like Soon2bmimi's atheist self-destruct button had a delayed reaction on old rhudean07. Love it, all the bigoted and biased atheist slant coming out of you. Guess she struck a raw nerve, old dude, with her posts and the resultant praise she got for it. Truth, when faced with it, hurts, right rhuidean? ROFLMHO!

Sinclair Lewis? Really, dude? Like his comments "Intellectually I know that America is no better than any other country; emotionally I know she is better than every other country."

Looks like Sinclair and old Baywatch Obama both have something in common...they both fail to see

the specialness and uniqueness in the great USA. Guess y'all are three peas in a pod.

Old Sinclair was an accomplished writer, Nobel Prize winner, too, just like old Barrack Obama is too. Barrack never deserved his after just a few months in office at the time, and too often the Swiss lets politics play into their choices. Seems like those old Swiss just love American's who go out of their way to belittle their own country and attack American success and free enterprise. "Damn the great executives, the men of measured merriment." Sinclair Lewis quote, from a guy who attacked religion, Christians, free enterprise, etc.

Next time you decide to use someone, choose someone who isn't biased and out in left field like old Sinclair.

As to religion as a wedge issue, looks like Old Barry and the Dimwitocrites are pretty good at that themselves. The Democratic Convention was rather laughable. They got publicity for deliberately leaving any reference of God from their platform, got bad press, so Old Barry ducked the barrage and tried to reinsert God back in for his own political reasons. Then the voting fiasco, with the God reference booed down by the Dimwitocrites themselves! 2/3rds vote passed? Ha! What a joke, and lie to boot! It got voted down, but was declared as passed. Talk about some lying going on!

The Dimwitocrites then proceeded to trot out person after person and scripted "God" and scripture passages in nearly EVERY SPEECH for damage control....Lying hypocrites! If you're Godless, just say so. If you hate Christians, just say so. But DON"T PRETEND to be something you're not, and end up living a lie!

Oh, I think you're funny, rhuidean07! All that hate you got building up inside you is hilarious, that's for sure. I shared a few of your statements with my friends, and I got two reactions: Most of my serious Christian friends were appalled and found you deplorable. Most of my regular friends thought you were just a hate filled idiot. My older veteran buddies wanted to just take you out and beat the snot out of you. Sorry, but I couldn't find any atheist buddies...Guess that's because they're hard to find...They only pop out of the cyberspace network to throw their bombs and run for cover. Losers, liars and wimps, every one of them.

Soon2bmimi, I looked up your quotes, and found each one of them to be true. I googled Rhuideans atheist quotes, and they popped up on some of the craziest atheist sites on the net. Easy to find, and the same old same old cut and paste crap on each one. Keep up the good work, my dear. We need more people like you...honest and forthright.

LiedToAgainAndAgain,

Well.....I see you've reached the point in the debate when you realize you've lost and start blathering.

Revisionists, Malignant Cancers, Dishonest, Besmirching and OH...MY...Reason and Fact...

All this emotion and caterwauling over the mere notion that Christians are not entitled under the law to special treatment.

I know that the GOP/TP uses religion as a wedge issue to control the ignorant, ill educated and gullible.

But wow....Dude....

Sinclair Lewis once said........“When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying the cross.”

You and the rest of should be proud...You are trying to prove him correct.

Rhuidean

Soon2bmimi, I went back and reread your post once again. After reading these quotes from our Founding Fathers, it is easy enough to see that religion played an integral part in the founding of our government as we know it today.

Atheistic revisionists like Rhuidean07 use their pathetic diatribe to try and diminish the men as well as their accomplishments. They are antagonistic, desiring to divide rather than unite American's. In looking at these quotes that you so poignantly listed, especially that of George Washington, any attempt by these atheistic malignant cancers to try and twist them for their own sordid desires and purposes is not only ridiculous but also downright dishonest.

There are those that try and destroy America and to besmirch her name, staining her garment with their own dirty grime and filth. They take pleasure in attacking our country, our family structure, our faiths and beliefs, and use those basic freedoms that so many have fought and died for, for their own vulgar purposes.

Nasty people...one and all.

God bless America, folks! And I DIDN'T have to try and reinsert that statement about God back into my RNT platform, unlike the lying hypocrites at the Democratic convention.

Atheist: Lack of belief in a God or Gods

Is it not a fact that thousands of Gods have been worshiped in human history...

Is it not a fact that Christians do not believe in a single one of these "Gods" as defined by the word atheist.

Sorry to be blatantly obvious...but does this not mean that not only can you be a Christian and an Atheist, but anyone who claims Christianity or any other religion is also an Atheist by definition.

I will cast a Godly vote in November like all true Christians. No mistake about it now, God would not vote Democrat in November. Notice I said true Christian will not vote Democrat. There are however hypocrites out there that will go to church on Sunday and vote Obama on Tuesday. God have mercy on you.

What version of history do you believe in?

I believe the civil war was over the constitution as it made kings of congress who under the articles of confederation were not much more than a massinger. Under the AoC we told washington what their rights were. Under the constitution they tell us what rights we have. They are subject to change anytime congress wants too. After the war you had to take an oath to defend the constitution, not the country or the people. Those books in school that of course had to be approved by congress is what congress agreed you should learn. Get a copy of our anthem not just the first verse but the whole song. God is in every part of our country. Not an order that you believe, but never to be forgotten that we as a country do believe. In God We Trust. You have carried this with you as we all have because it is our motto as a country. Many things have been changed from the start of this country. Not all of these changes were good. There will always be powers at work to change it. We should be very careful as to what changes we allow to happen. To change history all you have to do is destroy any copy of the true history and wait one generation.

Liedtoagainandagain,

Revisionists? Ok believe what you want.....

No amount of data will penetrate your bubble of ignorance to history.

Nice down home homily though....

Rhuidean

Soon2bmimi, great post. Thanks for the atheist warning. Quite the comic, now aren't you? Enjoyed it.

Revisionists like rhuidean07 have been around for a long time, and will be for centuries to come. Just like a polecats stink, their smell just aint going away anytime soon.

Thanks for airing it out.

Soon2bmimi,

Good job with your research, your list is comprehensive and logically supports your argument.

However.....

I have never said the founders were not Christians...They ALL were....

Many however did not believe in the trinity. Jefferson and Adams chief among them.

But the question and debate we are having is whether our nation was founded as a Christian Nation....In essence a Christian Theocracy?

In a Theocracy church and State are one entity....

Now at the time of the constitutional convention there were many who viewed the founding of America as the divine hand of god at work and wanted church and state intertwined.

However if you review the records of the convention debate religion was a non issue.

But opinions aside the only document that matters is the constitution.

The preamble to the constitution states:

" We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."

No mention of God....All power and rights come from "The People"

The first amendment addressed religion.

" Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

Our constitution clearly states that we ALL are granted the right of religious freedom. To worship or not, to worship whatever god we want...Nowhere does it say that we must worship a christian god. Freedom is given to believe whatever we want and congress has no right to interfere or endorse any religion.

And finally Article 3 Section 1.

" The judicial power of the United States, shall be vested in one Supreme Court, and in such inferior courts as the Congress may from time to time ordain and establish. The judges, both of the supreme and inferior courts, shall hold their offices during good behaviour, and shall, at stated times, receive for their services, a compensation, which shall not be diminished during their continuance in office."

You may kick and scream and insist that this country’s 100% Judeo-Christian Justices have, for decades, pushed a subversive “agenda” of separation, but that idea is absolutely ludicrous. Do you even hear what you are suggesting?

Does that make any kind of sense?

What you think the Constitution means, or what any of us think the founders intended, does not matter. You can whine all you want that atheists and the courts don’t get it; it is nothing but sour grapes on your part.

The legal precedents are well established. That bell is rung, and you can’t unring it.

So feel free to worship as much and as fervently as you want...No one is stopping you...

However in the United States your religion does not get a special place or have state backing. EVER.....

I honestly do not understand why this is so important to the right wing.

Are you all so insecure?

Rhuidean

CharlesFord,

I agree that all the founding fathers had faith and were religious men. No argument there....

You Wrote:Take the role call on the men present for the founding of this country and you will see. The fathers did not want to exclude religion from government they wanted to keep government from controlling religion as the Catholic church did in the their homelands.

I reply: So take your poll and show the results....The constitution is completely clear. Religion and government are separate.

The larger question I ponder is..... why is this such a controversial topic?

It's common sense....There are millions of American citizens with thousands of differing religious beliefs...

Why would their government want to show favor to one sect?

It's ludricous......

Not one time have I ever stated you are not free to worship in ANY way you want....Never...

So go pray.......Pray often and early and late..

Smile as you pray knowing I and all my atheist friends are

on the express elevator to Satan's foyer.

No skin of my back....

The only thing you cannot and will NEVER have is the power of the state behind your religion.

Why is that such a difficult concept to grasp?

Rhuidean

every Godless person I know loves quoting a couple of items from several men who were part of the founding of our country. Fact is the a very large number of men were responsible for this unique page in history and a the majority of them were God fearing and even ministers. Take the role call on the men present for the founding of this country and you will see. The fathers did not want to exclude religion from government they wanted to keep government from controlling religion as the Catholic church did in the their homelands.

I do not want the government telling me how to worship but I also do not want a government devoid of religion and that is the fine line that the founder were attempting to follow.

Liedtoagainandagain,

You Wrote:Looks like the atheist on here keeps avoiding your post, soon2bmimi, about the founding of our nation and the rewriting of our history to fit into their liberal slant of things.

I reply: Avoid? Are you serious? I have provided examples in that the United States was not founded as a "Christian Nation" several times.

But Hey...Just for you I bring the words of Jefferson and Madison out again.

" Believing that religion is a matter which lies solely between man and his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legislative powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their Legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof," thus building a wall of separation between Church and State (Letter to the Danbury Baptists, 1802).

And Another:

In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own (Letter to H. Spafford, 1814).

How about some Madison...You've heard of him right? He's only the guy who wrote the constitution.

"An alliance or coalition between Government and religion cannot be too carefully guarded against......Every new and successful example therefore of a PERFECT SEPARATION between ecclesiastical and civil matters is of importance........religion and government will exist in greater purity, without (rather) than with the aid of government. [James Madison in a letter to Livingston, 1822, from Leonard W. Levy- The Establishment Clause, Religion and the First Amendment,pg 124"

And the coup de grace...The treaty of tripoli...No ambiguity in this document.

" As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion,—as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Mussulmen [Muslims],—and as the said States never entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mahometan [Muslim] nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries."

You Wrote:No one in their right mind could possibly think that religion played a ZERO effect upon the colonization, settlement and founding of our country. What a load of crock from the wingnut left!

I reply: I have not said religion played no part in in our forefathers lives.

I state that religion has no place in our government...And our forefathers agree with me.

What it must be like to live a life so ignorant of our history.

You brag about facts....So provide some and I will gladly have this debate.....

Come on show me what you got.

Rhuidean

Since the word "God" was also left out of the Constitution do you also condemn the founding fathers? Or do you realize they had some purpose in the omission? The final Democratic platform does include the word, of course, which many attribute to the intervention of President Obama.

Finally, I assure you as a Christian progressive, God receives frequent mention in my Bible study lessons.

Looks like the atheist on here keeps avoiding your post, soon2bmimi, about the founding of our nation and the rewriting of our history to fit into their liberal slant of things.

No one in their right mind could possibly think that religion played a ZERO effect upon the colonization, settlement and founding of our country. What a load of crock from the wingnut left!

Obama1kinobi mentioned numerous examples of religion in our past sarcastically, calling all of them a myth and a fairy tale too. That is exactly the kind of garbage that only a lunatic like rhudean would post.

The clown likes to dance all around and dodge the real facts.

The truth is, revisionists like rhudean are a dime a dozen, and aren't worth squat. I could care less if a person goes to church or not. I rarely do, but that's my decision. But I do have a problem with the liars like rhudean that lies through his three teeth about the history of our country and tries to convince someone that an apple is really a orange, and that he can back it up because you can eat an apple and it tastes mighty good so the guy that planted it wanted oranges instead of apples.

I don't know if God will forgive them; but I'm sure Billy Graham will. I'll never forget the time Billy appeared on Johnny Carson stumping for Bill Clinton when Clinton was under attack for all his transgressions. Billy said he had forgiven Clinton and we all should also forgive him. I didn't get the memo that God delegated that power to Billy.

The lyrics of a popular song go something like this. "Jesus walked on the water and we all know that's true. But sometimes that preacher man likes to do a little walking too."

Watchingit,

You asked: How do you feel about Christians on the left side of the political spectrum? Do you feel the same contempt for them that you do Christians on the right?

I reply: You seem to be unable to understand my argument. I do not feel contempt for Christians of any political bent. Right, left in the middle....Your faith in your deity is immaterial to me.

My issue is with any religious group that wants their beliefs to be supported by the power of the state.

For the last 30 years or so those attempting this are overwhelmingly from the right wing. Truth must definitely have a liberal bias....Hmmmmmmmm

Soon2Bmimi,

You wrote: My response: Difference is, "true" Christians do care...We think you're ALL misguided at best and delusional at worst.

I reply...Ok your entitled to your opinion...No skin off my nose.

You then go on about how mean I am because " I lump people into groups"

Excuse me? Did i misrepresent any of the positions of the Southern Baptists? Did I not accurately describe right wing Christians opposition to Gay Marriage, President Obama's birth certificate, Abortion and LGBT rights?

So called True Christians are enacting laws that discriminate and want to further discriminate against those minorities.

You have facts to prove me wrong then.....Bring Em.

Obama1Kinobi uses verse to spew vile and racist code words throughout.

You said you agree and that he tells truth.

Seriously......Is this truth?

Begin Quote: Another thing I'd like to add...It's not true that we Democrats are "using" blacks and taking them for granted. We are concerned. In the last election, I only got 98% of the black vote. Skin color never, ever was brought into consideration when they astutely cast their ballot...4, 5 or 6 times....for me. But I am concerned about the 2% that voted for the old white guy....What were they thinking? An old white guy? A white guy? White? You'd vote for Whitey instead of Mighty as in me?

Begin Quote: In fact, I don't think it's so! I think that the Republicans have rigged some of these ballot boxes to automatically give them 2% of the vote. Either that, or they're denying black voters the opportunity to use a Black Panther as a reading assistant when they're casting their vote. Something’s up?

Now...... if you that funny and true then...Hokey Dokey...

You act as if by pointing out the total hypocrisy of Christians I am personally attacking you.

Not true.... You’re not worth the effort.

Rhuidean

Soon2Bmimi,

You Wrote: You’re right when you imply what the atheist left is doing at respinning America's history in order to revise it to suit there own atheistic means.

I reply: That's an entirely nonsensical statement with no factual basis upholding it.

Have you ever actually read any of the various founding fathers documents?

Most all were self professed Christians but many including Jefferson rejected the "Holy Trinity" ...Wait isn't that sacrilege to present day right wing Christians?

How about Thomas Paine? if you read more of his work and not cherry pick he had some pretty harsh words for bible thumpers.

You get all worked up thinking that us mean old atheists actually give a poop who and how you worship...

Well we do not...Give one single moment of thought to it.

If you believe in the Trinity then good on you, If you believe in transubstantiation then eeeeew but ok, If you believe in magic underwear in temple then by golly have at it.

If you believe in Allah and scoring virgins then good for you, If you believe In Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva then light that incense dude.

If you believe in aliens and wear tinfoil hats like the birthers and Tea partiers then yeah baby wallow in ignorance...

Atheists really do NOT care...We think your ALL misguided at best and delusional at worst.

However......

If you want to make legislation allowing the lawful hating and discrimination of LBGT people because Crazy old Leviticus says so...Then we have a problem.

If you screech and holler and wail that government should stay out of our lives then insist only you can control a woman's right to control her body.....Then we have a problem.

If you want to engage in crazy conspiracy theories about how our democratically elected President is a secret Kenyan Muslim then by all means...Get your loon freak on...But when you try to sue to remove him from the ballot based on that loony belief then we have a problem.

When in your cold little hearts you howl against Gay marriage because of that crazy Leviticus guy you are free to do so. Heck Southern Baptists used that same rationale to defend slavery...However when you attempt legislation to legally discriminate.... We have a problem.

You see we atheists don't care about your religion....We care about the vile and hateful behavior you engage in then claim "It's not me Jesus says to act this way"

BTW Obama1Kinobi is his usual racist self and as you say you agree with him? ........Hokey Dokey now......

Prosserian,

Where in the world did you get the misguided belief that being religious bestowed ethics?

Are you serious??????

I am sure the mental gymnastics needed for a Christian to vote for someone they consider a cultist is hard...

But dude......................

Rhuidean

It all depends how they choose to use religion within their presidency. If they begin begin to make policy solely on the basis of religious beliefs, I believe that is not within the vision of our forefathers. I believe a man can use his religious beliefs to help guide him on ethics and fairness but not to make policy. I am a atheistic Republican, we are rare, but we exist. If you all haven't figured it out yet, our current President is an non-admitting atheist. Romney does not believe in Santa Claus or the tooth fairy yet he beloved in the Mormon version of God. I fault him for that, however I believe he will make ethical and fair decisions because he chooses to follow a religious doctrine. Obama could care less because he knows there is no afterlife and allows his ethics to be among those of Chicago gangsters, terrorists and thieves.